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78. The #1 Reason High Achievers Get Stuck In Business

When someone tells you it’s probably going to take you 6 months to achieve your goal, do you instantly challenge yourself to do it in 3?

Andrea did this recently and it unlocked some serious revelations about how high achievers approach their business to-do list AND how they support their clients.

You’re going to want to tune in very carefully to this episode of The Profitable Nutritionist™ Podcast to learn:

  • 3 strategies Andrea has employed for taking the pressure off herself this year while she works towards two new goals
  • Why high achievers use goals against themselves and how to support your high achieving clients to slow down so they can actually speed up (it’s very #meta)
  • The exact questions to ask your clients when you coach them to unlock what’s really keeping them stuck and confused
  • What to-do list item to prioritize on your weekly calendar immediately to 10x your business revenue and actually support your health along the way



Andrea Nordling 0:00
Friend Welcome back to the profitable nutritionist podcast. And incredible part two episode coming your way today, as we are talking about Linked In, how fun is this? So last week, I did the part one episode where I explained why we are back on LinkedIn here at the profitable nutritionist what the strategy is there and I got really tactical, on explaining how you can follow the very sage advice that we’ve been given as company to optimize our profile, we broke that down how you can use the same information to optimize yours for client and referral partner conversions to maximize your effectiveness and your reach on LinkedIn. So fun. Now today, and in this episode is part two of this LinkedIn conversation, where I have the pleasure of bringing on my dear friend and serious LinkedIn expert, Olivia Zacharias to talk to us. Now I first of all, I love Olivia, because I love the way she teaches, which we talked about in this episode as well. Her brain works very differently than mine. And I love her. If then, kind of formulaic. She calls it flow charting. She says she has a very flowcharting brain. And she does. And the way she teaches is just blows my mind, and is very tactical. So you’re going to love this episode, if you are ready to roll up your sleeves and get in and figure out LinkedIn and you want to know what buttons do I push? When do I push them? How do I do this? What do I say? What do I not say? All of that is coming your way in this episode, it’s going to be amazing. But the reason I had Olivia come on and explain this because she has grown her entire business primarily off of LinkedIn, which she goes into a lot of detail. And of course with her story on the episode. So I knew she was the person that was going to tell us all of the things, and she did not disappoint in the least. Specifically, she goes into the four ways to meet clients on LinkedIn. And to sign clients on LinkedIn. These blew my mind. By the way, I did not know these strategies, and I’m so glad she shared them. And then we got into what I thought was going to be what we talked about for most of the episode because I didn’t know we were gonna talk about how to meet clients on LinkedIn. But then we got into how to use a virtual coffee chats to get referral partners strategically that will send you clients as well. That one I am telling you is going to change your entire business. So I cannot wait for you to listen for ways to meet clients on LinkedIn as well as how to use virtual coffee chats to get referral partners, and get those new partners to send you clients as well. It’s gonna blow your mind. I probably shouldn’t give this spoiler, but I’m going to give a little teaser here. I had an idea that was genius when we were recording the episode. So I told her totally unscripted. This is something I’m going to add inside the profitable nutritionist program, which I’m really excited about. The idea came about during the episode, you’re going to hear it in real time as you listen. So you should know that when you join the profitable nutritionist program when enrollment opens for the next enrollment, which is coming right up September 14 to the 20th. If you’re listening to this live, you are going to get to partake in this new LinkedIn. Is it a resource? Is it a? I don’t know what to call it this new LinkedIn tool that we are going to be implementing inside the program? Do I have your attention? I hope I do. It’s going to be amazing. So public enrollment is going to be next September 14 to the 20th. Like I said, if you’re listening in real time, that is when you need to mark your calendar to join the program we open quarterly so you do not have all of the time in the world to join. This is the time coming up September 14 to the 20th you can get all of the details for the program at the profitable nutritionist.com/join. And if you’re listening in the future and enrollment is not coming up, you can go to that same page and you will always see the dates of the next enrollment period. So again, that’s the profitable nutritionist.com Don’t forget the slash join. Okay, my friend. Enjoy this episode and I will see you inside. Okay, we’re live Yeah, I am so excited for our recording today because any time I get to spend time talking with you my dear friend Olivia Visakha row, the man the myth, the legend. I know it’s gonna be a good time. Who knows what we’re even going to uncover today. But I think it’s going to have something to do with LinkedIn and maybe something to do with coffee chats. I think it’s gonna be magic. It’s gonna be so good. Yeah, it’s gonna be so good. Okay, so for everyone here will fry everyone ever listening? You need to know that Olivia is mind works in mysterious ways. To me it you call it a very flowcharting mind. I love what you say this to whether you like my brain is very flowchart it and I love that because mine isn’t mine is like looking at the top of a Candyland board and I’m like looking at the whole board from the top but not flowchart it at all. So I love that when you say that I always am like oh, I wonder how she’s going to think about this in a flowchart anyway because it’s so different.

Olivia Vizachero 4:55
The data is amazing. I I love how your brain works because it is so different than mine. And that’s such a great analogy for how your brain works. I can totally see that. And I think you’re strategic in ways that like, I’m not because you’re looking at it from like the bird’s eye view up above. And I just Candyland was my favorite board game. I love it. Yeah, yeah. So

Andrea Nordling 5:17
that’s how I always think about it. I’m like, I see the whole game here. I see, we’ve need to get to the palace where the princesses we can’t be getting stopped in the swamp in the dirty swamp the chocolate swamp, we can’t be getting stopped there.

Olivia Vizachero 5:30
I know, this is why you have to be friends with you. Because I need more of your perspective. In my life. I’m like, This is why her your business is just doing things that like I mean, I’ve got an amazing business. But I’m like, I need to be more Candyland strategy up up ahead. But the

Andrea Nordling 5:46
flip side is why we have so much fun. We have so much fun talking about all of the strategy and all the things. So all that to say, I love your point. I mean, we both have a lot to learn from each other. Because I love how you teach things in such a methodical way. And you’re like you just it’s this to this to this. And if this then this, if it’s just like, I love that I know this because Olivia came in and taught a consult intensive on how to do a high converting consult. And she did this in my mastermind group. And then the recordings are now in the profitable nutritionist program and in the mastermind. So for my students, you know, Olivia, already, Elena, you don’t know this, but people rave about you like in our community all the time. People are like, you guys, I just went through the console intensive. It’s over six hours long, by the way, it’s very meaty. We did I don’t think I told you this. We did a companion PDF with like all of your slides and all of the questions to ask and all of the if then statements that Olivia presents in the concept like if someone says this, then do this. If they say this, do that. So we did this, this really beefy PDF that goes with it. So people find the bonus course they go through it. And then they’re like, constantly you guys do you know, of course. I just saw someone’s post, like, literally just this morning. She’s like, I have been terrified of consults forever. And now I want to do as many as possible. Like, I just want to collect all of the concepts that I can. I’m so excited after going through Olivia’s course. So all that to say, once again, oh, he’s got the goods on the strategy. Don’t let her tell you any different. So let’s talk about LinkedIn. Let’s talk about your coffee chats, strategy and all things LinkedIn, actually, you probably have secret, LinkedIn things I don’t even know about. But I do know about coffee chats, because in our lengthy strategy chats about our businesses, this has come up and I was like, Oh, I’m gonna circle back with her. And we’re going to do a podcast on it. Yeah, today’s today.

Olivia Vizachero 7:36
All right. So can I just start from the top go? All right. So when I teach my clients to do like organic marketing, I really walk them through five phases. And I think all of the five phases really inform your strategy for LinkedIn. So the first phase is you have to know your offer. And that is so important, like who you help, how you help them what you help them do, what that looks like, because it’s going to inform who you’re contacting and connecting with on LinkedIn, for coffee chats, for just building your audience getting more eyeballs, on your content, all of that stuff. So we’ve got to know exactly what you’re doing. So once you know your offer, you’ve got to meet people tell them what to do add value ahead of time and to make offers to help them right. So once you know your offer, I always start with meeting people. And I’m really obsessed with LinkedIn. For this reason I started my business mainly on LinkedIn, and 2020. And Instagram was kind of an afterthought. For me, LinkedIn has always been my bread and butter, the majority of the money I’ve made in my business has come from LinkedIn, it’s been a very profitable platform for me. And I realized, like some of it, I learned, just by happenstance, kind of fumbling my way through it. And then some of it, like, I got intentional about it. And I tried to tweak things and play with it. And I came up with my own strategy that I now teach people. But if people are familiar with pods on LinkedIn, LinkedIn engagement pods are like a big thing that people talk about. And it’s where you create, like a group of people in a group chat on LinkedIn. And you all are on the honor system, you all agreed to support one another’s content. And I got invited to join one of those back in March 2020, I think when I was just getting my business off the ground, and people have different opinions on whether or not like you’re cheating the system, whether you’re like being heavy handed, or like putting your thumb on the scale, whatever your opinion is, regardless, what I’ve learned from doing that exercise and being part of that group, is that engagement needs to be reciprocal. So that I’m going to talk about in a little bit, but I just wanted to give like a background of my intro into LinkedIn. So engagement is huge on LinkedIn, and that’s going to be part of your strategy for meeting people and telling them what you do and adding value. But first when it comes to meeting people, when we know who it is We’re working with and you know your offer, I break meeting people down into two different categories. So we start with direct clients. And then the second category is referral partners. So the reason I love LinkedIn is because you can literally search for people by their job title, which is incredible, because it’s an amazing way to find these ideal people, right? Like, so good, is different from any other platform, like, finding a lawyer on Instagram is like her handles like Suzy pants 42. And that is hard to figure out whether she is a lawyer, you have to go I coached lawyers, so that’s why I’m using this as an example. But you have to go into her bio, and it’s like a cat, her kids, you know,

Andrea Nordling 10:49
die. When are you coming back to Instagram? And I’m like, no, no more specific.

Olivia Vizachero 10:57
Authority to and like, maybe you get lucky and she has scales of justice, maybe and you’re like, Oh, she’s a lawyer. Amazing.

Andrea Nordling 11:04
So I think your video is breaking up a little bit. Is

Olivia Vizachero 11:07
it on your end? Or my end? Only? Um, you just broke up for me? And I broke up for you. But yeah, yeah, I didn’t break about my end, but you broke up. For me, I broke up for

Andrea Nordling 11:20
you. Okay, well, it’s recording the audio on both of our sides. So we’ll be able to use the audio either way. So good show must go on,

Olivia Vizachero 11:26
kids are gonna edit this out, or people are gonna love this part of our chat. So keep it real over here, you guys anyways. So you’ve got to break it down into these two different groups, direct clients, and referral partners. So for direct clients, think about the exact person who would hire you now, for me because of my niche. And my focus on attorneys, its attorneys. So I searched for attorneys. There’s four ways to meet people. Okay. So you want to get an idea of the exact people you’re meeting. If you don’t work with attorneys, and you work with I don’t know, women with health issues, right. So like, a lot of your people would work with just normal people, they don’t have to be a particular occupation in order for them to hire them. So you just have to pick. So make a list I like to suggest make a list of 10 different options. Because the problem is you can’t search in LinkedIn woman with like IBS.

Andrea Nordling 12:32
You certainly can’t you should you don’t want if you can find that person on LinkedIn, you don’t want that person as a client.

Olivia Vizachero 12:41
So funny that you say that I got a connection request today from a woman who had a coffee chat. So funny. This is so meta right now. I had a virtual coffee with one of my former clients, my client raved about me. So she reached out and connected to me and then sent me a direct message, which we’ll talk about that don’t do that. But she sent a message, introducing herself to me and I checked out her profile, I accepted her I’m not like stingy with the accepting friend requests or connection requests. But I looked at her profile and her tagline which we’ll also talk about it said fart joke queen of LinkedIn. And I can’t even use the awkward without like cringing and

Andrea Nordling 13:20
it just got so sweaty. Totally, totally.

Olivia Vizachero 13:29
I’m still uncomfortable right now that I just like said it out loud. But I had to give like the direct quote. So bad though. And I was just like, oh, I never want to talk to you. Like you’re not my people, you’re not. So to Andrew’s point, if someone if you can search woman with IBS, like, we don’t want that, right, or Epstein Barr or whatever. So you can’t search for people like that. But that doesn’t mean don’t search for people. It just means you have to figure out the intentional way to search for people, that would be your ideal client. Okay, so I have a client of mine who is a grief coach, right? So it’s just like people with grief. But in order to connect with people now I suggest you connect with people who have money and can afford to pay you if we’re being real brass tacks about this. Okay. Sounds like a great strategy. Yeah. So I searched for people, I think about what are job titles where people would have money to pay me now you might work with, you know, if someone isn’t a nutritionist, and they want to work with a different type of person, if you are a business coach, work with entrepreneurs. So thinking about the job titles, they would have owner, Founder CEO, right things like that co founder, you have to search for that. So the four ways to meet people. Number one, you can just type in the job title in the search bar on the top of LinkedIn. Okay, and then you click on people, and a whole list of people Are 1000s and 1000s and 1000s, or 10s of 1000s, or hundreds of 1000s, based on what you search will show up, or even more than that. And you just connect with people, you just send a connection request, you get 100 A week, they are not like rollover minutes from your cell phone plan from the 1990s or early 2000s. Nope, they are not, do not get more of them next month, if you don’t use these this mother this week, so you get 100 A week, do not squander them, you should max it out and have LinkedIn yell at you, they’ll eventually cut you off, and you want to hit that Max every single week. If you don’t, because you’ve got some mindset bullshit going on. We’ve got to clean that up. So the two things that I see my clients struggle with, when I give them this guidance, they’re like, 100, I could never. And I’m like, I think you could because it takes me about five minutes. Really easy. Like I definitely think you could, and they’re like, there’s no way I’m like, how many do you think you can do? And they’re like, 10, I’m like, That’s the wrong answer. Okay, that’s just false.

Andrea Nordling 16:09
So it feels so good Connect.

Olivia Vizachero 16:13
Oh, my God, I like it hi out, it’s so much fun.

Andrea Nordling 16:16
It makes like a little ding sound. That’s very Yeah, it’s great.

Olivia Vizachero 16:20
So if you’ve got drama around this, it’s either number one, you are being a perfectionist about it. And you’re thinking that like you have to connect with the perfect most ideal client that ever exists. So you keep going into people’s profiles and researching. And then it takes you an hour to connect with five people, because you’re wasting all this time, you should not be looking at anyone’s profile, it should say enough from just their job description that you want to connect with them. And then for the other thing that people do is they get in their head about sending an unsolicited connection request. Now, I recommend not sending a message along with a connection request. Unless you’re paying for premium and you’re using in mail people won’t see your message until after they accept anyways. And you’re probably just clogging up someone’s inbox, most of the people who are really experts on LinkedIn and spend a ton of time there, we don’t love getting those messages. My only goal is to send a connection request. So that person’s eyeballs are going to be on my content, my content is going to pop up in their feed. And the reason that this is so effective on LinkedIn specifically is because LinkedIn is a reciprocal connection. And that is not true for a lot of social media platforms. So on Instagram, if I follow you, you automatically don’t follow me back, you have to actively proactively have your own volition go follow me to for my content to show up in your feed. So with LinkedIn, the beauty of it is that there’s reciprocal connection. So we just need them to connect with you, and then your content will show up in their feed. So first way we do this is we type in the search bar. Second way we do this, we go to think of a company where your people might work. So and I

Andrea Nordling 17:59
mean, this could be local companies to you would be a great place to start like what start in your own backyard, when you probably know people that know people that you’re connected with.

Olivia Vizachero 18:09
So this is another great thing to think about. I always connect with people who I’m second degree connections with, and the more people we have in common, the better. So I have a very big audience on LinkedIn now. So I normally have a lot of shared connections with people, especially because I used to be a lawyer and I work with lawyers. So when I’m connecting with lawyers, we normally know a lot of people at different firms. But I like to, you’ll notice when you do this, maybe the average for you is that you have five people in common, amazing start, they’re like send those connection requests first, maybe you only have two people in common. And then the rest of the people you just don’t know, because you’re new to doing LinkedIn, then send it to the ones where you have any shared connection. And you’ll have a better success rate with this. People are like, Oh, they must know me somehow. But a great example of that I love the suggestion to start with local businesses, because you’ll know people there you’ll know people who know people, and will see that you’re from their same area. So it’ll feel warmer and make more sense to connect. Also, if you have you know, a part of your business or an aspect of your business where you do work with people more from your general jurisdiction or demographic, right, like it just makes sense. I have a client who works in Jacksonville, and she could work with people from all over, but she kind of prefers to work with people in Jacksonville. I’m like, great. There’s a ton of business owners in Jacksonville. I think we googled it and or not Google that we searched on LinkedIn, like for owner or co founder and then filtered by people and then filtered by Jacksonville. And it was, I don’t know, like a couple 10s of 1000s of people. And it’s just, yeah, that’s all the connection requests you can send for like the next two years, or the next four years. So just do that. And this is what I mean, but like you can have a list of 10 You don’t need a list of 10 you can have have a list of three different job titles, or three different businesses. Like for me, I use law firms. Because all of those people there are most of the people, there are attorneys, and they make enough money. So even if you weren’t working with attorneys, you can also do this too. Like attorneys are a great demographic. They have lots of problems and money.

Andrea Nordling 20:21
Sure, oh, I need to just give everyone a reminder, I did it part one on this episode on like optimizing your own LinkedIn page and getting your own LinkedIn shit together. So it looks good, so that you feel comfortable connecting with people that you know, personally. And so it makes sense when somebody goes and creeps you then they’re going to end up on your website, and they’re gonna know what you do. Because if your clients I mean, I would be curious on your stance on this, Olivia. But I know for my people a lot of the time, like all of the time, no one in your life knows what you actually do. If you’re a coach of some sort that is like such a vague anything. We think people understand they don’t they have no idea what you do. No, probably kind of curious. But then it kind of goes on to a point where people in your life probably won’t ask you like, what what is it you actually do, I actually don’t even know. It’s mostly it’s like past the point where it feels comfortable even getting clarification. So let’s just nod their head and pretend they know. And they actually have no idea what you do. So your LinkedIn profile, it’s a great place to introduce them to what you actually do in the kind of person you actually help so that they can send those referrals your way

Olivia Vizachero 21:23
just so good. I just ran into my uncle. And he says, this is like it’s a compliment every time he sees me. I of course, don’t take it that way. Because it’s really not. But he’s like, people really pay you to just like they really pay you like people hire you.

Andrea Nordling 21:40
He’s just waiting for the day where you show up? And you’re like, Nah, I’m done with that didn’t work?

Olivia Vizachero 21:44
Yes, for sure. I’m like, they really do all the times. Like, they just I just can’t believe people pay you. That’s amazing. And I do think he thinks is amazing. But I’m like, it’s such a terrible way to tell me it is. So I agree, whether it’s your uncle or your friend from high school, or your former colleague at the job you laughs Like, they’re curious about what you do. And they probably won’t ask you, so give them away to find out for themselves. And then the way I describe this is they can be out in the world, like your little minions, telling other people what you do, and referring business to you. And that’s amazing, right? You’re the queen of referrals. So like, I know, you know all about that to begin with.

Andrea Nordling 22:24
It’s the best, it’s just the bet and I in LinkedIn is so set up for referrals. I mean, it literally tells you like what degree connection you are from the person, like how many referrals away are you from this person tells you, it’s it’s begging for it, it’s just

Olivia Vizachero 22:38
totally agree. So the second way is you search the business, I searched law firms, we in the practice of law have what we call amlaw 200, which are the top 200 firms in the world. So or am law 100, you can just like run that list and only search those firms, you can do that I could pick the same firm for a year and just max out all of their attorneys like that would be another way to do this. But if you, you know, want to pick a specific industry, and just focus on that it’s like, you know, tech, or women owned beauty companies or whatever it’s like just pick one or pick 10 businesses and go back there over and over and over again, and just make it easy. My goal for people is always to spend the least amount of time deciding what to do and the most amount of time doing it. Amen to that. Yeah, pick the 10 and don’t reconsider it. Right. Okay. So third way we meet people is we go to one of your connections, one of your first degree connections that you’re connected with already, and you go to their profile. So I would go to Andrea’s profile. And not everyone has the setup this way. So you’re gonna have to maybe do a couple trial and error connection tests to see this, but you’re gonna go to their main profile, and you’re gonna see their pretty little picture, to circle with their head net, and then their tagline, whatever that is. And Andrea has to be done with how much I’m talking with my hands on an audio recording right now. So good. It’s been doing it the whole time. So for those of you who are missing out on that, I’m so sorry. I’m Italian. It’s lovely. Anyway, so you got the pretty little picture, the tagline. And then there’s this little blue hyperlink. And typically for people because most people on LinkedIn probably have over 500 connections. If they’ve been there for a minute, it will say 500 Plus connections in blue font and it will be clickable. Click it. Now I like to go to someone who I’m connected with who has a first degree connection who’s already my ideal client, because

Andrea Nordling 24:38
I’m going I’m gonna listen to this episode myself and go do all of this. Give it

Olivia Vizachero 24:42
to me, is great. Your ideal clients know your ideal clients.

Andrea Nordling 24:47
They shared you. They shared you hang around them. It’s so true. Oh.

Olivia Vizachero 24:55
So you go into their connections. And then anyone In their connections list, that is the second there obviously a second degree connection because you’re in the person’s profile, who’s the first degree connection. So you just go down and connect to connect, connect, connect, connect to anyone who looks like your ideal client. So that’s Third Way. Fourth Way, and I love this way, I’m the genius. This one, I think the others are, like easier, they require like a little less searching. But this one is really, really good, especially if you’re thinking about how all of this dovetails into more engagement on LinkedIn. Okay. So, go through your feed, and find a popular post from someone who like looks like an ideal client. All right. Okay. So for me, that would be like, I’d find a lawyer’s post that did really, really well. And it’s going to have, you know, a couple 100 likes maybe more than that, if it went like kind of LinkedIn viral, maybe it’s in the 1000s, or more than that for likes or comments. But I go through, and I connect with everyone who liked or commented

Andrea Nordling 26:02
on it, because you know, they’re active on the platform. Love it. Correct. So

Olivia Vizachero 26:06
with the other three strategies, even though I liked them, and they’re very fast, the way you have to send connection requests to the people the fourth way, you actually have to go into their profile, and click Connect, which is why it’s more cumbersome. So I don’t start on it. You got to work on it. Yeah. Oh, great.

Andrea Nordling 26:25
But you know, that they’re on they’re liking things, and in the feed, that’s you.

Olivia Vizachero 26:29
So they’re commenters, they’re not lurkers, they like things, they, you know, engage with people’s content, they’re active. So they’re checking their connection requests, they’re more likely to accept, they probably also want to build their audience on the platform, because they’re using it. So I just think there’s a lot of gold there. If you are willing to spend time there, it’s definitely worth it. So those are the four ways. Yeah, you want to be thinking about the ideal clients, I always start there. Like if I’m sending connection requests, it’s going to be to my ideal clients, for sure, because I want their eyeballs on my content. But then you also want to be thinking about who is a good referral partner? Because the questions that I have people answer when they work with me, for meat, people flowchart brain, it’s like flowchart slash outline. So it’s like, Roman numeral one. I mean, people, actually, it’s Roman numeral two, because the first was no your offer but Roman numeral number to meet people. And then it’s like a direct clients, B referral partners. And under a, you’ve got in person and virtual. And under referral partners, you’ve got in person and virtual. And obviously, for the purposes of this conversation, we’re talking about virtual networking, but for each one of those subsections. So it’s like one and two, under direct clients, virtual and in person, you want to be asking yourself, Who am I meeting? Where am I meeting them? How am I meeting them? Right? So for direct clients, you’re just sending a connection request and then leave those people alone. For Andrea teaches something different, I’ll let her teach you something different. But it sounds great. Sounds like leave them alone. Let them come to your content, see it with their eyeballs, get excited about it lurk, and then click the link when you make an offer, you know, whether it’s like for your consult page, or to your website, or to your program or to whatever, let them do that.

Andrea Nordling 28:25
I will say they do that. And I I have told you this in the last month. So spoiler, if anyone hasn’t listened to the part one, I’m sure many people hasn’t haven’t listened to part one would just be tuning into this. I am newly back to LinkedIn. So I was on LinkedIn 100 years ago, and 2021, early 2021 in a bit of self righteous rage, I deactivated LinkedIn and all of my social

Olivia Vizachero 28:48
action from righteousness. Good rule of thumb, don’t do it.

Andrea Nordling 28:55
But I did. And I love my reasons for it. But now I’m back on LinkedIn, because I love my reasons for that, too, for all of the reasons that we’re talking about. So I’m back on like, Okay, now I’m going to do it really, strategically, this time, very excited to have a team helping me it’s not me doing all of the stuff anymore. And so bringing everyone on this journey, like this is just so fun. I’m gonna listen to all of this and do all of this myself. And I had a point and I can’t remember what it was doesn’t matter, kind of going.

Olivia Vizachero 29:18
But it was about DMing people I think about or no clicking links at the bottom that they actually do that.

Andrea Nordling 29:22
Oh, yes, that wasn’t okay. So I’m newly back in there. And I have been telling Olivia, this thank you for bringing me back to that. I’m like, really, the quality of leads coming to my website are substantially more interested, more engaged and taking more action. Like it’s remarkable. And the only thing that changed is being on LinkedIn. And I think it’s traffic that’s just following the breadcrumbs and coming to the website organically from LinkedIn. I did the only thing I can even chalk it up to. Yes, it’s amazing.

Olivia Vizachero 29:49
That’s how I made like, all of my money, all the money, give them the links. There are resourceful people, they will click the link and then they can figure it out from from there. It works. Yeah, people are They’re they buy, they’re serious. They’re kind of no nonsense. They’re sick of their problems, for lack

Andrea Nordling 30:04
of a better word. They’re professional, they’re ready to go.

Olivia Vizachero 30:06
Yeah, exactly. So when I’m thinking, That’s my strategy for direct clients, I’m going to identify them, I’m going to connect with them, I’m gonna leave them alone, I’m gonna let them see my stuff. And then I’ll tell them what I do through my social media posts, I can tell them what I do through the tagline, I always want to make sure people’s tagline and you already talked about like optimizing your profile and part one, but you got to make sure that people know what you actually do, who you help, what you help them accomplish. I see it with lawyers all the

Andrea Nordling 30:36
time, and it is not your resume, it could read like, it’s your resume, nobody’s gonna hire you that way. They don’t really care about you, they want to know that you care about them, and that you can help them. So it’s like, their resume.

Olivia Vizachero 30:45
Exactly. So like the perfect example of this lawyers do this terribly. And like I love them, but they have to change. I just did a post on this where it’s like low hanging fruit for business development. People will put like, Associate Attorney at name of law firm PLLC. And or, you know, partner at name of law firm, LP, like, I mean, that’s how law firms are, are titled, so it’ll be like that. And it’s like, okay, what do you even do? Who do you hold? Like, I don’t care what for me? If I’m in jail, do

Andrea Nordling 31:17
I call you if I need a patent? Do I call you What do I do? I’m not sure. Exactly.

Olivia Vizachero 31:21
Right. And even within like the trademark space, or the patent space, there’s so many different nuances. Like do you do patent prosecution? Do you do patent litigation, it just depends. So being really clear, as you’re engaging with people, because your tagline The reason that’s so important, people see it when you’re commenting on other people’s stuff. So a that’s something that you want to be doing to engage with people. But that’s really, really important real estate. So that’s what you’re going to be doing for direct clients for referral partners, you want to again, make a list? Who does it make sense for me to connect with and talk to who would refer me business? And what I think is so important, you want to be thinking about? Where is it a reciprocal value add? Because a lot of my clients, they’re like, Well, I want to do virtual coffees with, I’m just gonna use a lawyer example. I want to do virtual coffees with an in house Attorney General Counsel of a company, and they’re in private practice. So the general counsel would hire them. So the general counsel is an ideal client, not a referral partner. And I’m like, No, you’re not doing virtual coffees with those people, they know you want to sell them shit. So they are going to be repulsed. That is not a mutual value, add there is no value, the value is they give you their time, and you pitch them. That’s not what we want to do here. So instead, you’ve got to be thinking about the people who also serve your people. Yeah.

Andrea Nordling 32:43
So for my for holistic nutritionist and health coaches, I’m always thinking about personal trainers and gym owners that are so sick of talking about nutrition, and they’re not very good at it anyway. And they’re very confused about what to do. So that’s where my mind goes. Could be chiropractors could be naturopaths, there’s lots of directions, you can go there. Yes. So

Olivia Vizachero 33:01
thinking about who those people are, right, even, you know, I do some virtual coffees with personal stylists, because women who work in the practice of law are sick of wearing and tailor suits. And like only wearing and tailored suits. And nothing, I’m not knocking on Taylor, I’ve been known to where I’m at in my day. But you know, those people like I wouldn’t be the first thing that I think of, but they also work with attorneys. So I’ll reach out to a stylist and we’ll do a virtual coffee a connection call. So you want to be thinking of who those people are. Now, I think the best way to go about this is to to find them, engage with their content for a little while. So like it and leave a comment on it. Do that a couple times a really good strategy to do this consistently with people. There’s a feature on someone’s LinkedIn profile, you can ring their bell, and if you ring their bell, you always get notified every time they post. So then in your logo doesn’t

Andrea Nordling 33:57
happen on their end. Like they don’t actually get a notification that you remember 100 years ago on Facebook, when you could poke someone, this is what I was thinking.

Olivia Vizachero 34:06
Remember the Poke Yes.

Andrea Nordling 34:10
realize this is not great verb is. Good, we remove the bulk. Okay, so the ring the bell is not the LinkedIn equivalent of poking, just make

Olivia Vizachero 34:20
not all I can think of right now. Oh my God. Have you ever seen the show Lonesome Dove?

Andrea Nordling 34:26

Olivia Vizachero 34:29
He always refers to sex as like a quick poll. Yeah. Oh, for sure. For sure. For those who haven’t seen loads of dove fire show.

Andrea Nordling 34:39
It’s so good. It’s so good. Read the book. It’s about a mile thick. It’s worth every minute.

Olivia Vizachero 34:44
So good. Amazing. Okay, so you can ring their bell and then it will show up in your notifications every time they post. So you could just go to your notifications and be like, Oh, I wanted to comment on her content. So I could bring Andrea’s bell and then every time you repost it would show up for me. And I would be like, Oh, amazing, easy peasy, I can just go leave my comment. And after you do that a couple times, just because I think it makes it a little less creepy, a little warmer, you’ve created a little bit of a bond and you already have a relationship going. Now you can ask for like your first date. And I will message someone at that point and simply say, Hey, I love what you’re doing. I think we serve the same audience, I think we help the same people. I’d love to learn more about your business. I’d love for you to learn more about mine, would you be up for a virtual coffee? Would you be up for a connection call, and I just send them the link to my Calendly, which I already have set up with my calendar availability. And I don’t take offense, if they don’t get back to me. Most people do. If they say I’ve never had someone say to me that they don’t have time, I’ve had to say that to a couple people just depending on like, whether I’m launching or getting ready for a live event or whatever. I’m like, hey, now doesn’t work. But if you book something in December, I’m free then like, I can do that. But it’s really just a numbers game. So don’t worry about the rejection side of it, just trust that some people are going to be more than happy to connect with you. Because just like you want to talk about your business, they want to talk about there’s so this is why the mutual value exchange is so so important. But you go you can pick 30 minutes, 45 minutes an hour, I am chatty, so I pick an hour. And if you want to cut it short, because it’s awkward, you can always cut it short, because it’s awkward, but you go on the call. And it’s basically like a first date. But for friends who own businesses, and it’s like, you make small talk for a hot second, and then someone’s like, hey, how do you get into what you do? Tell me more about what you do. And then you kind of give your life story, the Warren Piece version or the shorter version, the cliffnotes version, up to you, depending on how long the call is. And then you go through your spiel, and then they go through theirs. And maybe you talk about like restaurants in Rome for a little while, because that came up during your conversation. And then at the end, I’ve had some people be like, you know, how can I help support you? And they like, make a really bold ask, and I think they’ve just been trained to do that you can do that. I typically don’t. And I’ve also prepared myself for like, I don’t offer anything. So like, I have a podcast, I don’t have guests on my podcast, I’ve had some people asked me to be a guest on my podcast. I’m like, Oh, don’t do that. But maybe I’ll think of some other way that we can work together. And I just like ended up like, alright, so great talking to you. So I say that because I think people get worried about people pleasing or like how to end those calls. And I think it’s just important to think through. But I’ve had like the benefit of doing this and so many people fight me on this. I’ll talk about that in a second. But the benefit of these virtual coffees like you do not understand the ripple effect. Let’s say you only do one a week. Okay, and you work 50 weeks a year, you cannot comprehend the ripple effect of 50 conversations like this, it will blow your mind. All of my speaking engagements have come from virtual coffees practically, like speaking at big conferences, not just like going into law firms and doing a presentation but like legitimate speaking gigs have come from doing virtual coffees, every podcast I’ve been on has basically come from a virtual coffee. And you get all of these opportunities. It can also lead to clients, referrals, all of that stuff. Some of the people you do virtual coffees with will be like, Oh my God, that sounds amazing. I want to work with you.

Andrea Nordling 38:29
Yeah, not to mention just your practice at articulating who you are, what you do. And just talking about your shed just that cannot be overstated. It’s just such a great venue for you to talk. Like you’re never going to see this person who if you completely blow it is all going to be okay. Just it’s

Olivia Vizachero 38:49
totally agree with that. And I have a client right now, I’ve been working with her like we’ve spent multiple sessions doing this. And it’s interesting, like even as her coach like she’s not seeing it landed the same way that it landed when she did a virtual coffee with someone. And I’ve tried to refine like her tagline basically like, what what is your offer? Who do you help? And what problems do you help them solve? And she has a lot of different ones. And it’s like too vague and too ambiguous. It’s just not great. And she just did a coffee with someone and he was like, I was really hoping for like something a lot shorter. So I could like pass it on to this person I know.

Andrea Nordling 39:29
Oh, did you see is that? Yeah, right from the horse’s mouth.

Olivia Vizachero 39:33
Yeah, no. So now she’s figuring it out. She’s like, I have to figure out a shorter way to say this. Sure. Do. Right. And I’ve been saying that for a while now. But it’s like when you hear it from someone else like and they just ask you questions that you haven’t thought through. So it’s like, well, what do you actually help people do if you’re like a life coach, and you’re like, Oh, I just said that. I was like, I help people live better lives. And they’re like, oh, yeah, but like how like tell me like what do you work with people on and you’re like, oh shit, and you have to figure out all these answers. And then it helps you come up with different ways to articulate what you do. It’s so, so, so valuable. And then that goes into your marketing and it can go on your website, and just it’s so good. Oh, my gosh, I love it. Yes. So that’s meeting people. That’s what you do with with them when you meet them. And again, it’s like you tell people what you do. If you can add value to the referral partners in some way, send them business, that’s amazing business will come back to you. If you do have a podcast, and you can have them on the podcast. Amazing. You don’t have to, but like just thinking about different ways that you can collaborate to get access to their audience, I’m always thinking about that, you know, how can I get in front of those people? And then again, I would think

Andrea Nordling 40:42
that there’s really good organic opportunities that just come up on these chats. Like how you can serve their people, if you’re thinking of people, that you that you serve the same ideal clients, in different ways, offer to do something for their clients for free, like, yes, what a better opportunity than Hey, how can I support them? And show a little goodwill? If if this is an opportunity that you would want? Like you have, you have the stage. And that’s a really great coffee chat for that person. It’s like, cool, I love it. If somebody’s going to come in and teach something to my people that I don’t know about, like, let’s get like this, right? Like,

Olivia Vizachero 41:19
let’s go. And that really is the basis of it. So if you’re thinking about, like, how do I meet people? How do I tell them what to do? How do I add value ahead of time? And how do I make offers. So thinking about that through your LinkedIn content, making sure you’re telling people what you do. And I like to tell them through examples, I see people make this mistake on LinkedIn all the time, they’re way too vague, people can’t see themselves in your content, and then really adding value. So teaching them stuff for free ahead of time. And then same thing, adding value with the referral partners, and then making an offer at the end, whatever it is, whether it’s to stay connected, whether it’s for them to book a you know, this is whether you’re working with direct clients, or referral partners, but is it to book or console? Is it to come to a webinar? Is it to sign up for email list? Is it whatever? And then if it’s referral partners, like what are the offers there? Connect with them? Invite them? And then is there some back end offer after the end of the coffee chat, but they will blow your mind? It’s amazing.

Andrea Nordling 42:18
I just I love the thought of that, like one a week you can for sure. Do you want to if you’re not full with clients, you can for sure do more than one a week. Don’t stop. But even if you only did one a week, amazing.

Olivia Vizachero 42:28
So I’m so glad you said that. Because no one told me this in the beginning of my business. I used to spend eight hours a day on LinkedIn, I thought the beginning of my business was gonna look like what the middle of my business actually looked like, where it was like, Oh, I’m gonna market some and I’m gonna have clients. And I don’t know why it seems very obvious now that the beginning of your business looks like zero clients. But that hadn’t dawned on me. And I think so many people, I’m sure you see this all the time, people are like, What do I do with my time? And no one told me this, but I came to this answer myself, I spent all of my time on LinkedIn. And so I’d wake up in the morning, I spent like eight hours a day at least I’d wake up in the morning, I would write a social media post for me that took about an hour, sometimes an hour and a half, my posts are pretty long. And back in the day, LinkedIn had a really short word limit. So you would like write a long post, and then you have to edit and edit it and cut it like in half, which was challenging to be that concise. Now LinkedIn extended it, it’s much longer, but I would write it and post it. And then I would engage with all of the people who are in my engagement pods. So they would share their links to their posts. And I would go and like and comment on all of their stuff. And then while I did that, we call it the golden hour on LinkedIn, the hour after you post is like the most important hour, and I would make sure I was online to respond to any comments I got and reply. That way. I’m increasing the number of comments,

Andrea Nordling 43:59
which I love it. So don’t just like willy nilly post it like time the post when you’re going to be able to be there maybe doing some of those connection requests, doing other stuff that you’re going to be doing on LinkedIn afterwards so that you’re there to respond. That’s genius.

Olivia Vizachero 44:11
Correct. And we don’t post and ghost. We can’t No, none of that. So people will post and then they like log off the platform and they go about their day we do not do that. That is a very unsuccessful social media strategy. Okay, so you got it. Big post

Andrea Nordling 44:28
and ghost over.

Olivia Vizachero 44:32
Most people are and I think the thing that is is neat about you is that you’ve grown your business and such I don’t know if like unconventional or untraditional way is the right way to describe it, but like not the way that a lot of people grow it using social media, right? But you have success for the way that it has worked for you. So it’s like if posting and ghosting has worked for you because you’ve built your success a different way. Then great, but what I see with people who do do rely on social media, they post and Ghost. And their strategy is not working for them. And this whole virtual coffee chat came out of a conversation with people who are plateaued at a certain point in their business, because their main strategy is social media, and they post and ghost and don’t have engagement and haven’t created their community. So what you’re thinking about, I understand it’s a virtual platform. But you’re cultivating a community and like LinkedIn, for lack of a better term, especially during COVID, like when the whole world was shut down. LinkedIn was a fucking party. And people were there all day long, commenting on each other’s stuff, some of my closest friends I met during that time on LinkedIn, and like, we all know each other, and we are all close. But like, think about it, it makes

Andrea Nordling 45:51
your book right now it’s sad. But this is a fantastic opportunity go,

Olivia Vizachero 45:55
I can never even think about it. I co authored a book with 19 other lawyers called hashtag networks. And we wrote about building business and cultivating relationships during a global pandemic. And we all met each other. I joined a group of 50 women on LinkedIn, this engagement pod. And we all came together built businesses and really formed very rich relationships with one another, through doing exactly what I’m saying, like, we were on LinkedIn, I started commenting on people’s stuff organically, just without anyone telling me that I needed to do that. Actually, that’s not true. Gary Vaynerchuk teaches this as well. He calls it his dollar ad strategy, where you leave your two cents on 90 pieces of content a day. So I knew to do this from him. But then I saw it work. This is how I got invited to an engagement pod because people saw that I was a good citizen already that I was active, I was publishing good content. I commented on other people’s content. I didn’t post and ghost I was active on the platform, I wanted to like be a member of this space. And then I got invited to this community. And then I saw the benefits of engagement and of reciprocity, because how LinkedIn specifically works. And this is true for like all social media. But man, is it true for LinkedIn, if your post gets more engagement, the platform recognizes it as good content, and it pushes it out to more people. So LinkedIn has phases. This is why we call it the golden hour and why you want the most comments within the first hour, because it tests your content to like 10% of your audience. And if it does, well, then it pushes it out like the next hour to 30%. And then if it does, well still, then it pushes it out to more. So if you’re not getting any engagement, because you’re not giving any engagement and engagements, a game of reciprocity, then very few members of your audience are seeing your stuff. And I think that’s why people get so discouraged with social media. But it’s like, it’s actually in your control on whether or not people see your stuff, be a good citizen and engage with people. So we ended up co authoring this book about how we all use LinkedIn, during the pandemic, to grow our businesses and our own personal stories. It’s really, really great for anyone who is interested in learning about how 20 Different women did it during the pandemic, you can find the book on Amazon, All proceeds go to charity, SoCal. And I mean such a neat project. But like truly when I say you’re cultivating a community, like most of the people that I’ve commented on, and was in this pod with, and like, so many of them have hired me. They’ve worked with me for years, they worked with me one on one, now they come to my group programs. When I travel, I see them, like they shout me out, they share my content with other people, they refer people to me, they post and tag me when it’s something when they’re like, Oh, this is about time management. Olivia, this would be perfect for you chime in here. Like it really does feel like a party, it feels like you’re at your you know, college or law school reunion or whatever with all of the people that you would socialize with. And it really is your duty or like your responsibility to cultivate that through spending time engaging with people. And it’s like over time what that builds into, it’s just really beautiful. Not easy, but Okay, so

Andrea Nordling 49:22
now my mind is going brilliant. unedited thoughts. Like I have hundreds and hundreds of people in the profitable nutrition is programmed that would probably want to do a pod and support each other engagement wise, is that a thing to do? And how do you do that? What’s the structure of said pod? Where does the pod live?

Olivia Vizachero 49:38
Pod lives on LinkedIn.

Andrea Nordling 49:40
It’s just a chat as like a group chat. Where you’re like, This is the link to my thing I just posted Yeah, in the chat. Okay. Yeah, so

Olivia Vizachero 49:49
LinkedIn has like groups. You don’t do that. It’s like clunky and doesn’t make sense. So it’s literally just a group chat now maxes out 50. So you’d have to start multiple,

Andrea Nordling 49:59
we could do Multiple genius done. Love it.

Olivia Vizachero 50:04
Yeah. Now there’s some, this is the edited version. So like LinkedIn frowns on this. Yeah. And they say like, you’re not allowed to do this. And like, hopefully LinkedIn, higher ups don’t listen to this podcast episode. Yeah, track me down. But like there is there is a risk involved in doing it, I have found that the reward is significantly outweighed, just because I get access what you’ll learn when you do this, and these people from the pot engage with your content, their connections, so it’s not just that LinkedIn pushes it out to more of your audience. LinkedIn pushes it out to their audience as well. You know, if you commented on something of mine, because you thought it was good content, LinkedIn would show my posts to more of your audience. So so many of my clients have come from people in my network and my pod and whatever, engaging with my stuff. And they’re like, Oh, I’m friends with Cameron. And Cameron commented on your thing, and it popped up in my feed, and then I started following you. And it’s like, yes, that’s literally how it works. So beautiful.

Andrea Nordling 51:15
Yeah. So we could do a prayer, we could do like a group chat in the private community for the program. Like we could even do it off LinkedIn. Yeah. Because, you know, spying eyes and all that, like, do we could do super secret. And, I mean, realistically, it’s never going to be the same people that like, you know, a percentage of the people in the pod are going to be on that day and see it and the amount of time it’s like going to be a difference.

Olivia Vizachero 51:40
So our rule is, if you drop a link that day, you have to comment on everyone who drops the link that day. Okay. Now, that may be challenging with 300 people versus, you know, 50 and not everyone posts every day. Right? Right. So you gotta gotta think about that.

Andrea Nordling 51:58
Okay, call to action people in the program. Well, first of all, if you’re not in the program, what are you waiting for a second fit in their program? That we need to talk about this? Figure it out? Someone’s gonna be ambitious to figure it out. I love it. But no, I love coloring outside the lines in this way. Like, it’s just, it just makes sense. Yeah, me too.

Olivia Vizachero 52:15
I also think, I mean, if we’re being really unfiltered here, like, what a great thing to offer within a program. Yeah. Yeah. Like when I tell you, I’ve made hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of 1000s of dollars.

Andrea Nordling 52:31
Let’s listen to Olivia, shall we? It seems

Olivia Vizachero 52:35
like I don’t do it. Because I mean, I do think it’s fun. I have fun doing it. But like, I don’t just do it. Because I think it’s fun. It is very profitable. It works. So to create that for people like I joined a pod. And, you know, one of the things you’ll see is that we used to have two chats, I still have two chats to all my pods, I have a thread, a post thread and a chat thread. So if people want to ask questions about LinkedIn, or like make small talk during the pandemic, our chat thread was like, we always describe it as a 24 hour coffee shop. If you were like going through a crisis, or just freaking out or work socks, or whatever, like during the Korean times, like the dark days of COVID. It was really like a beautiful sports system. And we would exchange LinkedIn tips and secrets like should you put your link in the post? Should you put the link in the comments? What happened? The answer to that, by the way, it’s changed over time. So you used to really get penalized for putting it in a post. So it was always put it in the comments. Now the penalty is pretty much equal. So I include it in the post because I think there’s friction and requiring people to go to the comments and look for it. So I put it in the post. But like answers to those questions of like, what about creator mode? Do I want creator mode? Do I not want creator mode? Do I want the Follow button? Do I want the connect button you want the Connect button? People are just less inclined to follow than Connect? Because one’s reciprocal one’s not so like all those questions, we had a place for it. So the posts thread wouldn’t get clunky with links and conversation and all that. And in the original one that I joined, you know, unfortunately, like just arguments between like women in the group ended up turning, turning it into more of a place of like, drama and conflict. And I was like I thought about it. I tolerated it for a while I was like I’m here, this serves my purpose serves my business. It’s fine. And then eventually I was just like, this doesn’t reflect my values anymore. I’m out. And I started my own. And I’ve started a couple I think have started to and like I’ve run them and built them and some people drop off. Some people join you know, it ebbs and flows. But it really is such a beautiful thing to offer people and I’m so glad that I finally got in my own way and I did it myself, but to offer something like that to your people like I’ve invited clients of mine to mine, friends of mine and it’s While they start to do it, and maybe they’re a little hesitant at first, and then they give it a go. And like one of my clients, we talked about it all the time, because she really doubts that she’s in control of creating her results. And when she finally started doing these things, listening to me, she would send connection requests, instead of sending 10, she’d sent 100. And now she sees like people book a console the same day.

Andrea Nordling 55:23
Hmm, that’s amazing. That is amazing.

Olivia Vizachero 55:27
Because they go to her profile. They’re like, Oh, who’s this? And then they see it Oh, optimized, because you’ve listened to part one of this two part series, yes. And then they go to your website, and they just book the book, the console right there, or sign up for your program or whatever. And now LinkedIn has a feature, I think it’s only if it’s in creator mode. But you can put a link in that like top tagline area on your profile, and like, label it, like label a hyperlink book, a console or something like that schedule a call. I think it’s only if you’re in creator mode, but totally valuable.

Andrea Nordling 56:03
And part one, you do want to be in creator mode, by the way. Okay, I have to go to content. Before we wrap this, I have to ask you about what kind of content are you putting out there? So my suggestion is repurpose emails. My people are big on emails, because they’re following me. You know, and seeing that I’ve email, email, email. So I’m like, take your emails, and like, make a teaser of the whole email. If it’s long with a call to action, get on your list, maybe you put the whole email, maybe you put parts of it like you get creative with what you do, but repurpose current and past stuff that you’ve already made. First, my opinion, that just makes the most sense. But I want to hear from you like what kind of stuff are you putting on there?

Olivia Vizachero 56:43
Yeah, so really good. I think you got to think about the frequency that you’re posting. So I think there’s right answers to this and wrong answers to this think the wrong answer is anything less than three times a week per week? Okay. Yeah, I think you got to be showing up. It’s a community, you got to be present in the community to be remembered in the community, right? So people have to be seeing you. So I think three to five times is a great frequency. If you want to do it every day, don’t do it more than any than once a day, LinkedIn will cannibalize your content. So like, if you post a second time, it will stop promoting and pushing out the first post within a 24 hour time period. So no more than once a day. So content that I like is number one, I don’t love video on on LinkedIn, I haven’t had much success with it. It’s gone through different phases. I think LinkedIn is very much a writing platform. I’ve just watched people do video with subtitles, and it like doesn’t really work. And people don’t have their volume on. It’s not Instagram, it’s not tick tock. It’s not like that. So it’s written content, or like written content with a photo works. Well, I do a lot of that too. But I like thinking of it. So I break it down. Like you want to talk about a specific problem that your people face, and then a specific solution. And then make sure you’ve taught them something. Sometimes if you just teach them the solution. You’ve taught them something that’s valuable. But I always want to think about what can I give them that they can implement right now without me and then make an offer. So it’s like very specific problem. Here’s what your problem is, here’s why it’s a problem. Here’s the solution to the problem. I taught you something valuable. If you have this problem, I can help you click here, do this like call to action, right? So those really specific examples, I think are what resonate with people like stories, paint people a picture, let them see themselves and what you’re talking about. I know shorter posts do do better on on LinkedIn, if you can keep them shorter. What else you really want to be thinking about like what’s above the fold, as they call it in like the newspaper industry. But like what’s above that see more? So what what is your hook, I find a lot of people really struggle with that. That’s something that I’m being really intentional about right now. Like I want the strongest hooks that I can have in order to get them to click See More, and then take it from there. Yeah, I don’t like articles on LinkedIn, I it takes people outside of their feed. I don’t think people like that. So I’m not a fan of that. I also, this is a strategy that I use. I’m really big about your content being on brand, because you need to tell people what you do and add value. And if you’re talking about stuff that’s not on brand for you, you’re not telling people what you do or adding value, right. So it’s confusing, but I do think that not every post needs to meet people tell them what you do add value and make an offer. Every once in a while I will do something really light that I think either really light or more personal that I think is going to do really well just to get more traction. So an example of this would be I used to do fun Friday posts have gone away from it because I just like just do content on brand right now. But I actually just did this last Friday, I think last Friday, last Saturday because you can Do something really light, like what’s your favorite legal movie? Oh, your favorite fictional character, right? Or fictional legal character. And every lawyer on LinkedIn wants to chime in and argue about whether it’s Lieutenant Caffee from A Few Good Men or Harvey Specter from suits, or, you know, whoever, they all want to chime in on that. And then I go, and I use that to meet people. And I go connect with all these new people who have never commented on my stuff before. And because they’re engaged with one post, they’re more likely to engage with other posts, and my posts are more likely to show up in their feed now, so I’ll use that it’s kind of like popcorn or candy, basically,

Andrea Nordling 1:00:36
do you repurpose yourself from Instagram on LinkedIn? Or vice versa? Or is it vice versa?

Olivia Vizachero 1:00:41
Everything starts on LinkedIn. Okay, love, but like LinkedIn is my core, like LinkedIn is my my main place. So everything starts there. And I used to do that specifically, because LinkedIn had a shorter word count. So it’s like, if it fit on LinkedIn, it would fit on Instagram. Now, I actually have trouble with this because LinkedIn word counts longer than Instagrams. So I normally have to cut down and edit. And it just makes it a little cumbersome. I think, like you get to play with the features and see what works like LinkedIn offers polls that you can do. I don’t do a ton of that. I got started with LinkedIn when it was like just writing. So I write Yeah, and give people valuable stuff. And normally, I’m like painting a picture. But the

Andrea Nordling 1:01:23
steps that you’ve already outlined is plenty to like, why did why add to it? Why oh, plenty, no

Olivia Vizachero 1:01:31
specific problem solution, teach them some shit, you can offer at the end, if they have this problem, like, that’s the format I teach. I also suggest for people like if you have something that works for you, don’t worry about having 10 different formats, like three different post formats. So like maybe like list or just pick one format, like I just gave this tip to my client. He’s been struggling with getting started on like, just do a three bullet points every time you think about a topic. I also will I’ll add this for you one of the co authors of hashtag networked. Her name’s Shari ballots. She’s one of my great friends. We met through LinkedIn during corn times. She is a trial consultant, her content is awesome, very creative. And she can paint a picture like it’s nobody’s business. She’s really incredible. And she makes these like, themed song lyrics for trial consulting, like she takes 80s rock songs, and she’s really inventive. It’s cool. So you can do that. Like she picks the same things to do the same theme or the same idea and just changes it. But one of the things that her and I do that has been really powerful for me in the content creation space, we call it content brain. And we will just pick an item, anything around us, like any noun, basically. And it’s like, write a post about that. And make it relatable to your business.

Andrea Nordling 1:02:55
Oh, that’s just broke my brain, right?

Olivia Vizachero 1:02:57
So I can do that with I could do that with your business. I could do it with my business, I could do it. With Sherry’s business, I could do it with a criminal defense attorney, I could do it with an insurance attorney, like a family law attorney, I could literally pick anything so like snow storm, just that. And it’s like, how would you write a post about that? through the lens of a life coach for lawyers, I would talk about like being late for work because of the snowstorm. And now you’re like late and panicked and frustrated with yourself, but also the weather and you’re in a terrible mood and the rest of your day is shitty. And I would talk all about like managing your mind. Now Sherry might talk about you’re a juror on this big case and you’re stuck in a snowstorm or like you have to leave your house to work from home and you have to go schlep through the snowstorm to get to court. Does that impact how you view the case how you deliberate your attitude as a juror, right? And like just picking anything? So it’s like alright, for anyone who helps someone with like, IBS.

Andrea Nordling 1:03:57
The snowstorm comes and you’re perfectly, like curated dinner that you were going to cook healthy doesn’t happen because you can’t go to the grocery store. And you call Domino’s again.

Olivia Vizachero 1:04:07
There you go. Or like you, you know, if you have like digestive issues, like you’re stuck in a snowstorm and like you panic, yeah, panic. Right? And like someone who has those symptoms, they’re reading that and they’re like, Oh, my God, that happened to me, but I wasn’t in a snowstorm. It was when I was like waiting for the subway, and like, and like they just feel it in their body when you’re so specific like that, even if it’s not the exact story because people don’t get specific because they’re afraid to leave people out. Right. But when you’re so specific, people can see themselves in it. Yeah, they’ll make the story fed. They do. And it’s those stories like when you really think about the content that resonates with you. For me, it’s very specific stuff. Like there’s this trademark lawyer She always post stories about companies fighting with each other over logos. And I remember them. Like, I know that home chef and Grubhub have identical logos. Hmm. And now when I think of trademark disputes, I think of her, right. So it’s those very specific stories that will resonate with your people, they’ll see themselves and they’ll remember it. So it’s like, it creates an emotion in them. And people are making emotional decisions when they’re choosing to work with you, in a, in a good way, but like, we want it to be an emotional experience for them. So you have to cultivate that through your content.

Andrea Nordling 1:05:34
Yeah, I’m always thinking about for nutritionist in particular, I mean, I think any type of health coach, probably any wellness practitioner, like, like we said earlier, you people don’t really know what you do. We think that they do it, we think it’s very obvious. So like, of course, if you have insomnia, the first thing you do is you think about your blood sugar. And it’s like, the whole world does not. Nobody knows that. So I’m forever woke my brain. I’m like, Ah, that makes sense. Now. Yes, we’re like, of course, well, yeah. Like, nobody knows that. So I’m always saying like, you have to say things like, no, yeah. Anyone you know, that has insomnia, you have to send them to me, and then they’re gonna connect you and insomnia together. Just these make it so simple to make those connections. So I love like kind of what you’re saying there with your content on LinkedIn, like do that. But then you are leveraging this very easy way for people to share that with their network, like, even if they’re not trying to LinkedIn is probably going to do it for them. So

Olivia Vizachero 1:06:27
Correct. Yeah. Which is amazing. The other thing, and I think this is especially true for your people, is I hear from people who aren’t lawyers who I work with, when they think about going on LinkedIn, or I hear it from other entrepreneur, friends of mine, other coaches that I know, they have a lot of mind drama of like LinkedIn is not the platform for me. I don’t belong on LinkedIn. I’m not a professional. I am not talking about professional business stuff. I don’t belong there. And it’s like, that is not the CEOs decision making, right? Like, yeah,

Andrea Nordling 1:07:03
this is so funny. This my husband said this to me, he’s like, I don’t get why you’re on LinkedIn. Like you don’t want a corporate job. I was like, what he’s like, isn’t that just for like, so you get like headhunters find you? Right? Yeah. So this is this is a very recent conversation I had Oh, you’re so cute. Look at you.

Olivia Vizachero 1:07:21
I just had this conversation with I don’t know if you know her Janae. Yeah, she, I am begging her. I’m doing a call with her. Like in a couple next week. I’m like, you have to be on LinkedIn. For anyone who’s listening. She is a brilliant college admissions coach, for students who want to get into Ivy League schools. And you know, who doesn’t pay her? The students? Do you know, who doesn’t pay the parent? They are

Andrea Nordling 1:07:49
LinkedIn. And they want to see that she is legit, before they write that check. Genius.

Olivia Vizachero 1:07:55
Sure. And like the people on LinkedIn are the ones who care about where their kids go to school, right? But not everyone does. And like, maybe I’m not trying to generalize here. So like, no one come at me for this, but like, come at, are we generalizing

Andrea Nordling 1:08:07
all the day? Do it. But

Olivia Vizachero 1:08:11
those people are going to care, right? Like where their kids go to school, and they probably don’t have time or the resources or the knowledge to help their kids themselves. So it’s like, click the easy button, hire Janae. She’s amazing, brilliant. And I’m just like, You’re so good. You have to be there. So I think the question is like, number one, are your people there? And if your people are there, then you should be there. Like, that’s an easy decision. Right there. Anyone listening

Andrea Nordling 1:08:36
to this? Your people are there and people that can refer their people to you? Yeah, for sure.

Olivia Vizachero 1:08:41
Yeah, agreed. And then the other thing that I focus on is, you have to train your brain, what to look for one of my friends used to do this. And she really sabotaged her business, because she would get on LinkedIn and start making money. And then she’d psych herself out totally success and tolerance. But she’d psych yourself out and be like, she was a relationship coach. And she was like, my stuff’s not professional. It doesn’t belong on LinkedIn. And people would like comment on some of her posts and be like, take this to Facebook. And then I’d like just feed into her. My drama, right? Yeah. And then she’d quit and then she’d stop making money. Because as we both talked about LinkedIn is highly profitable. And she’d go to different platforms where her return on her time spent there wasn’t nearly as great as what she was getting on LinkedIn. And then she’d freak out and go through some months of really low income or no income, and then she’d come back to LinkedIn and she just kept going through that pattern. And she would always look for all of like, the most professional posts, and I gave her this guidance where I was like, Look, there’s plenty of quote unquote, unprofessional ones, like where someone’s talking about like I did a post my cat died. I have no problem doing that. It was love of my life. So I wanted the whole universe to know about it. And and like also to warmed me up and like, have let people in on a personal part of my life, right? Like, I’m not trying to game or be weird about that. But like, also it’s like a marketing practice of like, I’m letting people in on things in my life that are going on celebrations to add moments, all of it. So they feel like they know me. And if you look for those examples, people will talk about, you know, parents dying of cancer or suffering from cancer or Alzheimer’s, or, you know, their kids and cooking dinner on Sunday nights and health issues, or mental health or whatever. Like, you’ll find examples of whatever it is that you’re looking for. So if you’re looking for, it’s only professional, the stuff I’m talking about isn’t welcome here, you’re only going to see that. But if you force yourself to look for examples, of all this other stuff, this diversity of ideas is welcome here, you’ll find that

Andrea Nordling 1:10:50
Yeah, yeah, it’s almost like our brains are like, prove us true. It’s like almost like that. It’s almost like our thoughts create ourselves or something

Olivia Vizachero 1:10:57
almost like

Andrea Nordling 1:11:00
this is so good. Okay. So like I said, In the beginning, I mean, I’m just gonna do a very shameless commercial for Olivia and her brain again, but like, selfishly for me, because I captured her for over six hours in the console intensive. So if you love what you’re hearing here, and you’re like, This is the exact actionable what to do and what not to do that I need in my business life. Come in the profitable nutritionist program, you get a lot more Olivia. And you’ll learn exactly how to do a high converting konsult Which she is a genius at executing, doing and explaining. And I love it so much. So that is how you find her in my world, the profitable nutritionist.com/join enrollment is opening September 14 through the 20th. Get in there. We want to have you there’s some sort of a pod brewing here. We don’t know what that’s all about yet. But something is happening with a LinkedIn pod. It’s gonna be great. So that’s how they find me. But how do they find you? And how do they how do we all connect on LinkedIn? Where are you tell everyone how to find you? And

Olivia Vizachero 1:11:59
yeah, so I’m on LinkedIn.

Andrea Nordling 1:12:03
Justin, you can find her there.

Olivia Vizachero 1:12:05
So I’m under my name Olivia Zakho. So you can go and connect with me there. I’m also on Instagram. Those are my two platforms of choice on Instagram. My handle is the less stressed lawyer. I also have a podcast called The less Dressler podcast. And frankly, if you’re a human with the brain, it’s probably relevant to you. So if you like me, and you like learning from me, and you’d like my flow, chardee brain that you’ll probably love my podcast. I also teach monthly webinars, if you go to less stressed sessions.com forward slash sign up, you will find my whole years worth of virtual events that you can sign up for and attend and their trainings on all the things I didn’t even know about that offer amazing. Yeah, there are my webinars, because I have a flow to the brain. My webinars are amazing.

Andrea Nordling 1:12:55
You guys, she teaches just as you can see, just so well, I love it. Okay, so we will have all of that linked up in show notes for this episode. Obviously, this is just amazing. I am going to have so like I said, I am not personally doing all the LinkedIn now. I mean, I’m obviously in the mix on the setup, and what are we doing and how are we doing it? And what do we want it to look like? But I’m doing this thing called delegating, which is a painful and liberating experience all at once. It’s like this really freedom inducing torture, but it’s like how do you have someone else do things instead of you do them?

Olivia Vizachero 1:13:29
I’m learning. That’s the chocolate pit on the Candyland board.

Andrea Nordling 1:13:32
It is it? Yes, it totally. Totally. So I’m going to have Karla listen to this. Obviously, we’re going to have lengthy meeting about this strategy and discussion. And then I’m going to try to figure out okay, so how do I train someone to do this like me, because it’s not going to be me most of the time. So this is like a new puzzle that I’m figuring out too. And I’m happy to come back and report on that as as we’re doing it too. But you’ve given me so many good ideas. I love this so much. Everyone’s going to love it. Thank you for spending time with us today. As always, my pleasure. Thanks for having me.

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