Andrea Nordling 0:00
Hello, my friend, welcome back to the profitable nutritionist podcast. I am very, very anxious excited. Anticipatory. I don’t know what the what the word is, but I am eager. There it is. I’m eager to talk about today’s topic with you because I know that this is a situation that will come up for every single business owner. And it’s great to have a strategy about how to handle it and to be thinking in advance if you have never had a refund request before to be planning for that because it will happen, or to handle an existing refund request if this is something that you are dealing with right now. So here is the context. This is a question that I coached on recently in the profitable nutritionist program. And if you haven’t joined yet, what in the world are you waiting for? This type of conversation is what awaits you every single week on our live coaching calls, along with so much more. You shouldn’t be there, the doors open for the last enrollment of the year on December 1. So if you’re joining us put it on your calendar. Of course, you’re joining us, I’m going to do an assumptive close here, of course, you’re joining us put it on your calendar, December 1 is the day. And all of the details for the program can be found at Build a Profitable practice.com/join. all lowercase. All right, so here is the question that she asked. I’m gonna paraphrase a little bit. She said I had what I thought is an ideal client pay in full for a four month program last weekend and then cancel on me Thursday via text of all things very unprofessional, like breaking up via text.
Andrea Nordling 1:33
He wants whatever kind of refund I can give. I’ve never had this happen before any of it so much so that I don’t even remember where I wrote my cancellation policy. I’m looking for it. But I don’t know what it is. I’ve talked to several peers, I’m not trying to take it personal or go into fear about burning bridges toward my client goals. But I’ve never done this before. So the context here, her ideal client paid in full $2,400 for a package and is now canceling. She doesn’t know why she doesn’t know what’s going on. So she said, How do I handle this? How do I handle this, I’m starting to second guess, my entire program, I’m starting to second guess my ideal clients, if I’m talking to the right people, which we all do, right. So here is the coaching that I gave her, then as soon as this coaching was done, I made a mental note must record podcast about this. Because it is so, so useful. And again, this will happen to you. So first of all, nothing has gone wrong. If you have a client that requests a refund, it’s going to happen, the more humans on this planet that you work with, the more it will come up. In fact, as your business grows, it’s going to happen more and more often. So just get used to it, this will happen. Now, that’s not to say that there aren’t things that you can do to be proactive in mitigating refund requests, or in attracting clients that are going to flake like on you in general, because there is a lot that we can do to mitigate it, but it will happen sometimes, it’s kind of like getting a hater for your business, you will get them at some point, it’s a milestone to celebrate. When you get your first hater, it means you’re repelling some people, which is a clear indication that you’re also boldly attracting other people, which is what business is all about. It’s just part of the gig, so you’re gonna get some hate, or sometimes you’re gonna get some refund requests, sometimes nothing has gone wrong, it means you’re in business. Now, when you get a refund request, it is a celebration that you are working with clients, I want you to reframe this in your mind, okay, this was going to happen, I knew this was gonna happen at some point I’ve planned for it, or I am resourceful. And I’ll figure it out right now if you haven’t planned for it. But this means I’m working with people. I’m out there, I’m making offers to them, I’m helping them. I’m talking about my business, I have a real business. All of these are the things that are happening when you get a refund request. So celebrate all of those things, and keep it in perspective. Okay, that’s not a problem. Now, here’s the rest of the coaching that I gave my student around this situation, number one, sleep on it. Never answer in the moment when your emotions are high, never responded to a refund request sleep on it for sure. Number one, no excuses. Like one 100% You need to give yourself a little time for your emotions to come down and for you to be able to get some perspective around the situation and formulate your response. Now if this happens, live face to face, you also are going to give yourself time to sleep on it. So never make any promises or never answer. In the moment. It is unlikely that that’s going to happen. Most people will request a refund via text or via email, because it’s the least confrontational thing to do. So most of the time, you will not have someone live on in person that’s going to be asking for a refund. But if they do, just let them know it is your policy to review that internally and you’ll get back to them and two business days or whatever your policy is, but sleep on it. Never answer in the moment when emotions are high. Number two, find out why don’t make assumptions on the reason that they are requesting the refund. Ask. I know this seems really basic. But in the moment when these requests come in And we tend to go to a really worst case scenario place in our minds, that they think that it was a terrible investment, they’re not getting results, they don’t think they’re going to get results. They think that we’re terrible practitioners, we can go to this really, really far fetched place. And we have no reason to do that other than we have human brains. And that’s what we do is we’re very negative, and we’re very all or nothing thinking. But that doesn’t mean it’s true. So don’t make assumptions on the reason that people are asking to cancel or asking for a refund, ask them and find out. I highly suggest as any part of anyone’s refund policy, to ask the reason and get clear on that as step one, after you’ve given a little space and time you’ve slept on it, then I want you to get clear on why they’re actually asking for the refund, because what you’ll find is, it’s very possible that you could help them overcome some perceived problem that they that they think they have, that doesn’t have to be a problem, or maybe doesn’t exist. A lot of the times the reason that people will ask for refunds is because they’re confused about something. And we can help clear up that confusion. So no matter how uncomfortable it is, and this is a learning step. So I realized, and I have done this before. So believe me no judgement. But as uncomfortable as it is to dig into the request and get more information, though your brain may want you to just send the refund to never talk to this person again, because it’s deeply uncomfortable. Don’t do that. Okay. Ask why, as part of your process, find out why they are canceling get detailed, so that you can understand it. If this is some perceived problem that isn’t actually a problem, or something that they’re confused about. It is entirely possible that other people may be confused as well. And that this is where you’re going to be evaluating the situation and creating a process to explain things better in the future, or creating a process to ensure that if there’s a breakdown in communication somewhere, or if there’s a breakdown in expectations, or if somehow they’re perceiving something as a problem, that isn’t a problem that you can create a process and a system to make sure that this doesn’t happen again. So though it is uncomfortable to ask people questions
Andrea Nordling 7:03
in this situation, and I know that it is make that part
Andrea Nordling 7:07
of your process, get as much information as you can, so that you can learn from it in the future. And so you can get a very clear understanding of is this is this a one off problem with this person? Or is this something that I need to solve for as a business owner? And you’ll know the answer the more questions that you ask. So step number two here is find out why. And then number three, is handle the refund for this client, knowing that your policy may be different for other people in the future. Now, here’s why I say that you can handle a refund request any number of ways. I know that most people who are doing one on ones, if someone asked for a refund, they would prorate for their one on one clients and send them a remaining refund for their unused portion of their package with what that’s what many people would do. My suggestion if you do that is to learn from this experience, and not to fight tooth and nail to keep the money. Unless it’s a really outlandish refund request or a really bizarre situation. That is not even remotely within your policies of what would be a reasonable refund request. Case by case, you’re gonna have to figure out what that means for you. But if it is just one of those times where you learn from it, you can lick your wounds, you can send the money back and move on send them with love, I highly recommend doing that. Because you are going to get your money’s worth from learning in this situation, either way. So for my client who had charged $2,400 for this client, I posed to her you can get $2,400 from this client either way, regardless of how you handle it. So don’t burn a bridge and shape your future policies and marketing that you’re going to be using, based on this experience. Learn from it, you’re going to make exponentially more than $2,400. From this experience, if you use it as a tool to learn from it, you use it as data, send that person their refund, send them with love. That’s what many people do. It’s what I would recommend doing unless it’s a really, like I said, like a really outlandish request. For the most part, that’s not going to happen. get very clear with that person on what is happening, how you can excuse me how you can address it for the future, how you could mitigate the potential that it would happen again, this is all good sound business advice. But ultimately, at the end of the day, people are probably going to get their refund from their credit card company anyway. So send them with love, don’t burn a bridge. I just think that in general, that is a good sound business policy is that we don’t burn bridges. And we treat people with love and respect. You know what that means for you in this situation. Now, number four is going to be using this as an opportunity for creating your future policies, of course and even if you have a really ironclad refund policy in place right now, you may adjust it and tweak it depending on what situations come up. So Again, this is just a reminder that a refund request from a client is a learning opportunity for you, as a business owner, it’s going to happen sometimes use it as the data that it is to inform the path that your business takes in the future. Now, I want you to have a refund policy. So if you don’t have one yet, time you’re listening to this episode, it’s time to think about that, and create one to the best of your ability. And to the best of your knowledge. Right now, it doesn’t have to be perfect. It is something that can change and evolve as your business changes and evolves. And as you work with more people. So to do this in creation of your future refund policy, or your refund policy, starting right now, I guess, create it when you’re calm, and when you’re proactive instead of reactive. So this is why I’m suggesting if you don’t have is, this isn’t something that you’ve thought of before. Or if you really haven’t put pen to paper on it before do it now before you get that first refund request. Because in that moment, you may be taking it personally, your emotions may be high, you may be a little defensive and a little thrown for a loop. That is not the time to be making sound business decisions. The time to be doing that is when you are calm, and you are being proactive, and you have a level head and you are evaluating all different scenarios, instead of being reactive to a certain person that’s pushing your certain buttons.
Andrea Nordling 11:24
Can you tell that I’ve had a few refund requests in my life? And I may be bringing personal experience into this episode? Yes, yes, I have. And yes, I am. Again, it’s not a problem. It means that you’re working with people, it means you’re repelling some people, it means that you are a business owner in the world. Don’t take it personally, on this coaching call with with this client. I said, Does Athleta take it personally when I return things? I certainly hope not. Because I do a lot of athletic returns. However, I do a lot of shopping there, I’m still an ideal shopper there and the products are still great in my opinion. And I would think I’m still a pretty ideal customer for them. But sometimes I return them. Sometimes I return things. I’m sure that the lady that is handling, My Refund does not carry their way it’s totally neutral circumstance to her. She’s not emotionally charged about me returning pants that I don’t think made my butt look big or look good. I don’t think that she cares, right. That’s how we can hope to address these refund requests in our business with a level head with a policy in place and move forward. Okay, it’s easier said than done. But I’ve been doing this for a while. So I can clearly see the value in having those refund policies set out in advance, knowing what they are, and then still giving yourself the freedom to amend your policies case by case. There may be situations where that is warranted. I guess what I’m trying to say here is just because you make an accommodation for one client does not mean that that is the precedent set forever, that you have to follow for the rest of your career in your business. That’s it’s not that way. You’re the CEO, you get to make the decisions. And doing something one time doesn’t mean that you’re going to have to do it forever or choose to do it forever. It’s your business. I think that people can get really hung up on that on thinking, well, everyone’s going to talk to each other, everybody’s going to know what I did. They’re not people are paying that that close of attention. And for the most part, they’re never going to talk to your other clients. Anyway. Again, that could be case by case, maybe you have a very close pool of clients. I don’t know, I suppose that there are situations where that could come up. But for the most part, it never will. And you making an accommodation one time doesn’t mean that you will do the same thing forever. It could inform your future policy. And what you decide to do with future clients may be having a more conditional refund policy like I do for my program. I don’t issue refunds for buyer’s remorse, I issue refunds if the program doesn’t work for you. So you have to actually get coached if something is not working. If something if you feel like you’re stuck somewhere you have to reach out and get coaching and actually try to solve the problem is then if it doesn’t work, a refund would be warranted. And that is a situation where we would look at it. But you know where that policy came from? It came from getting a few refund requests from people that had buyer’s remorse made me very clear on the fact that that’s not what I’m issuing refunds for and creating that conditional policy. So just know that how you do things one time in the beginning or two times at the beginning isn’t how you unnecessarily do them forever, that’s totally fine. We grow and we evolve in our businesses and in our own brains. Which brings me to number five, this is the fifth thing that I coached my client on and I would coach you on. If you are really struggling with figuring out what your refund policy should look like. I would suggest that you ask yourself this question. If I was fully booked, and I had a long wait list of clients, how would I then handle this situation? I’ll say it again. If I was fully booked and I had a long wait list of clients, how would I handle this situation? That question will help you step out of this reactionary, scarce offended. Energy, the lack energy and it’s going to put you into a CEO mentality who has the best long term interests of her company in mind. And it’s going to bring you into that energy of these are our policies. This is how we do things. And it’s going to help really clear it up for you, I would hypothesize So again, here’s the question, if I was fully booked, and I had a long wait list of clients, how would I handle this situation that may very well help inform your future refund policy, that is not really future. It’s something you’re implementing right now today. And I just want to reiterate again, that you don’t have to handle each refund request the same way, I have to be a broken record on this, just so you know, that there is no such thing as a precedence. Really, your business is going to change, the way that you handle things is going to change, don’t get yourself in into any legal trouble. That’s why I suggest err on the side of just giving people their refund, if they ask for it, especially in the beginning. prorated makes a lot of sense. Of course, if you’re delivering one on one service, it is going to inform the way that you mark it in the future and the way that you run your business in the future, it’s of course going to change. So just because you do something one time doesn’t mean that you’re always going to do that. You can deal with your refund requests on an individual basis. If you get one that comes up unexpectedly, which might be why you’re listening to this episode.
Andrea Nordling 16:16
Before you have those firm policies in place, then change it for the future. But I highly recommend setting up these policies if you don’t have them already in advance when you’re calm. And you can clearly see the direction that you would like it to go rather than being reactionary and defensive in the moment, but nothing has gone wrong. When this happens, it’s inevitable when you work with enough people that you will have these situations come up, you’re doing something right, if you’re having a refund situation. But if it’s a consistent problem, then you absolutely need to be doing some evaluation on how you’re marketing and how you’re selling that’s bringing in consistent clients that are flaking on themselves. Because that’s ultimately what’s happening here. It’s not necessarily a personal attack on us or our process. But what is happening is someone is quitting on themselves and on their own goals. And they want their money back, because they’re quitting on themselves. So if that’s consistently a problem that’s coming up, then for sure, you want to be figuring out how you can solve for that with the delivery with your clients, and then also with the marketing and selling beforehand, so that you’ve already addressed that potential situation, and you know, that you’re bringing in people that are much less likely to be wanting to flake on themselves, because you want to kind of train your clients to be your easiest, most perfect lines. And that’s entirely possible with your marketing. Your marketing is kind of like your pre onboarding of your clients. Think about that a little bit, which is great, right? Your marketing is the pre onboarding of your clients, you’re training them about how to be an easiest best client for you. And if you’re consistently having people that want to refund, something’s wrong in their marketing, right, and that’s something that you can adjust, monitor and adjust. Not a problem. Again, the more people that you work with, the more times that you will be monitoring, adjusting, it’s totally fine. If you are finding that you are really scared of even having clients, because you are just paralyzed thinking about what would happen if your future clients are dissatisfied in any way at some point. really put some time into this and create that policy, figure out what you would be doing because the all we need to do is go to that place and think, Okay, this is my biggest fear, someone paying me money and then wanting it back because they didn’t get the results they wanted. And for a lot of us as health and wellness practitioners, this is a secret fear that we have, we don’t necessarily say it out loud. But I hear it all the time, because I coach on this every single week. And just once again, if you need to hear other people that are wildly successful, but also having the same problems that you do, so that you know that you aren’t the only one having those thoughts join us in the profitable nutritionist program, you are going to see so many people who are very successfully navigating these exact same situations and growing thriving businesses, even though it’s not all perfect all the time. That’s what we do in the program. So if you are completely paralyzed about it, and again, I just want to circle back because I do see a lot of people that have this, this belief that it would be the worst case scenario, if someone paid the money, and then didn’t get results in one of that money back. If that’s a fear that you have, just go for it. Take yourself there. That’s the whole point of this episode, figure out how you’re going to handle it. When that happens, know that it will happen. We don’t need to over prepare and over plan and hide from that scenario. Let’s just go to the worst case scenario. Okay. That’s the worst thing that’s going to happen. Let’s solve for it. Let’s figure it out. What is the refund policy? What am I going to do? And how am I going to evaluate it and tweak for the future? So it happens less, just make a plan for it. When you know, I coach people on this all the time. So I know what happens in our brain when you realize, okay, that probably is going to happen at some point. What am I going to do? Well, I’m going to give them their money back. And I’m going to figure out what went wrong. Perfect. Just really not a big problem. And when we quit making it such a catastrophic event and realize that that’s just part of doing business, then we get out of our own way we go get more clients, we help more of those clients, and they’re much less likely to ever need a refund because we’re focusing on how to deliver to them at the very highest level, because we’re not afraid of it, you see what happens are so much better for your business so much better for your future clients, and so much more fun, really. So again, join us in the profitable nutritionist program, if you want to see firsthand how these things that seem like panic situations, when you’re working all by yourself behind your own computer in your own home office solo, seem catastrophic panic, panic panic when you see how those are actually not a big deal. Because you’re plugged into a group of successful peers and coaching that you can bounce ideas off of. And you can see people navigating it day in and day out and not making it a problem and you realize it doesn’t have to be a problem. And that is in valuable my friend, getting out of our own heads getting out of our own way. And realizing that we have so much to bring to this world, there are people that are waiting for you right now to figure out this refund thing in your head so that you can go help them so that you can sell to them. And so you can deliver life changing information to them. They’re waiting right now, just so exciting.
Andrea Nordling 21:07
I’m so excited for them. And for you. Now, I do want to let you know about a function of the program, where you really will have the easiest time navigating these topics, which is our small group breakout sessions. So in addition to the live coaching calls that happen every single week, where I’m coaching people on issues just like this, and you can certainly come to those calls and raise your hand to be coached and we will coach all day long. We also have small group breakout sessions, where you can bring topics like this to a small group of three to five people in real time, and get feedback and help from your peers who have also done this and navigated it and can help you with the exact situation that you’re facing. So we have two different types of coaching calls, we have the live coaching with me where you are going to see people’s other people’s brains get coached and you’re going to realize, Oh my gosh, I had that exact same thought at that exact same problem. And I didn’t even realize it, you’re going to get so much coaching from watching other people get coached. And you have the opportunity to jump on the small group coaching calls where we break up into rooms of three to five people, and really brainstorm and give feedback to each other do copy reviews in these small groups. So you can get really, really detailed feedback on your exact problem from your peers. I am telling you, it is so important to get out of the I’m doing it all alone mentality and into the I can learn from other successful people and quit trying to reinvent the wheel mentality. It’s very, very helpful. I see it every single day and I’m seeing the posts in our private community called the lounge where people are saying oh my gosh, this group is everything. I cannot believe that I waited so long to join because this is exactly what I needed. So I invite you. This is giving you that intuitive hit that maybe this is what you need. It probably is invite you to join us on December 1 for the final time this year when enrollment will be open. Again put that on your calendar bright and shiny on the morning of December 1. The enroll buttons will be live on the sales page, which again is build a profitable practice.com/join All right, my friend, have a wonderful week defining your refund policy if you haven’t already done so. It’s actually a great, great exercise for you by
